Mr Rayner's views of Electrification.

In article
<17fa2a89-aa99-4471-9a39-13fa5df0f42b@26g2000hsk..com>,
darkprince66 <darkprince17031966.uk> wrote:

> [ Regarding Tony Polson ]
> Yeah, I can't understand his problem. ...

Tony does go through phases, which can be quite long. Some while ago he
used to get increasingly fractious in many debates and then he
disappeared for a while. He later came back (in the guise of "The Good
Doctor") and was quite pleasant for a while, but he seems to be
deteriorating again. Don't take it personally.

Sam

On Aug 29, 5:42 pm, Sam Wilson <Sam.Wil...@ed.ac.uk> wrote:
> In article
> <17fa2a89-aa99-4471-9a39-13fa5df0f...@26g2000hsk..com>,
>
>  darkprince66 <darkprince17031....uk> wrote:
> > [ Regarding Tony Polson ]
> > Yeah, I can't understand his problem. ...
>
> Tony does go through phases, which can be quite long.  Some while ago he
> used to get increasingly fractious in many debates and then he
> disappeared for a while.  He later came back (in the guise of "The Good
> Doctor") and was quite pleasant for a while, but he seems to be
> deteriorating again.  Don't take it personally.
>
> Sam

I have stopped taking it personally, I've read some of the guy's posts
from past threads. It's quite laughable really ;-)))

Rich

On Aug 29, 5:43 pm, Tony Polson <docnews2...@> wrote:
> darkprince66 <darkprince17031....uk> wrote:
>
> >There is
> >probably still a role for coal fired power stations as well, I don't
> >know for sure, but would guess that technology has advanced since the
> >last coal fired stations were built, and a much cleaner burn is now
> >achievable, resulting in a smaller carbon footprint. Maybe we will yet
> >see a program of reopening coal mines?
>
> More pie in the sky.  Your lack of knowledge (or is it sense?) seems
> to spread very wide indeed.

Sense Tony, definitely sense. I reckon it probably spreads... ooh, at
least as far as your house ;-)))))))))

Rich

Am Tue, 26 Aug 2008 09:53:56 UTC, schrieb Tony Polson
<docnews2011@> auf uk.railway :

> There is a need for an independent study of rail electrification,

what should the subject resp. the question be?


L.W.

Am Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:29:28 UTC, schrieb "Peter Masson"
<peter.masson1@> auf uk.railway :

> a business
> case arises for re-equipping the West Midlands - Scotland via WCML route,
> including a cascade for re-use of the Voyagers elsewhere, no doubt the
> replacements will be electric. AIUI there is in fact an option on the
> Pendolino-lengthening contract which would allow for procurerment of shorty
> Pendos for this route.
>
> The motivation for further InterCity electrification in the near future is
> the impending life expiry of the HSTs, which means that new trains are
> needed especially for the GWML. If their replacements are diesel we are
> probably stuck with diesel trains on this route for the next 30 years.

Not necessary if the Voyagers are re-allocated to the GWML after
being replaced by electric trains on the WCML.


Cheers,
L.W.

On 28 Aug, 23:20, darkprince66 <darkprince17031....uk> wrote:
> On Aug 28, 10:54 pm, "Paul Scott" <notvalidpmsc...@>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "darkprince66" <darkprince17031....uk> wrote in message
>
> >news:3bb959fe-d5ca-4415-9d40-bce03541aeba@i76g2000hsf..com....
> > On Aug 28, 10:40 am, Tony Polson <docnews2...@> wrote:
>
> > > darkprince66 <darkprince17031....uk> wrote:
>
> > > >1) What is your justification for the use of diesel trains on a wholly
> > > >electrified route? I am not talking about putting new wires up, we are
> > > >both clear on each others views on that already, I am specifically
> > > >relating to the use of Voyagers on the West Midlands-Scotland trains..
> > > >If the electric rolling stock is not available for these trains, do
> > > >you not think that it should be procured as soon as possible?
>
> > > No. Why on earth should it?
> > > Ummm... How about a build of short Pendolino trains (say 6/7 coach),
> > > allowing more effective use of the OLE, and releasing diesel voyagers
> > > for use elsewhere... say XC. Rocket science it aint...
>
> > Not a new idea really, it's already mentioned in the Pendolino 'lengthening'
> > bumph on the DfT site, but for 8,9 or 11 car. Perhaps unlikely to happen,
> > but it is at least being discussed:
>
> > "a later Option (B) for the purchase of up to 23 new 8-car, 9-car or 11-car
> > sets (for the purpose of further fleet enhancement and / or displacement of
> > the Voyager fleet) as a 'run-on' to the core rolling stock procurement."
>
> > Paul
>
> A classic example of where a talking shop has been going on for years
> and nothing happens, at least not for a very long time.
>
> It has taken way too long for the Pendolino lengthening to get
> started, and even now, it's only a half baked scheme.
>
> AIUI, the current deal gets 4 new 11 coach trains (obviously one of
> these replaces the set written off at Grayrigg) , and lengthens
> another 31 existing trains to 11 cars, leaving the other 21 sets as 9
> car trains. The other later option would also include the possibility
> of lengthening the other 21 trains to 11 car as well as new build for
> non Euston services
>
> Great, except for one problem. By the time the other 21 sets got the
> extra coaches, they will be a good 10 years old, and when they become
> life expired, the extra cars will have another 10 years life in them,
> but they will be absolutely no use to anybody. I can't see the ROSCO
> involved taking too much to that idea, unless they marked up the lease
> charge on those coaches to reflect this. if that was to happen, the
> TOC will cry foul surely?
>
> Much as I would like to, I can't see the current set up finding an
> easy solution to this one...
>
> Rich

Something occurred to me some time after reading your post, namely
that even though the trains are in a fixed formation, why not take the
coaches from existing trains as a one-off operation to extend the
others and then resupply the host trains with the new coaches? You
still have the issue with the locomotives being older, but these can
be refurbished/rebuilt when life expired far more easily as it won't
require splitting the older sets. The coaches aren't all unique within
a train are they?