Family Railcards and 16 year olds

On 9 Jul, 20:13, "Pyers Symon" <pyers.sy...@clothes.zen.co.uk> wrote:
> Just come back from buying some tickets (at Worcester SH)
> for my sons & myself from Porthmadog to Worcester using a
> Family & Friends Railcard.Now I bought my railcard in November
> when my son was 15 but now he is 16.
>
> Anyway I had quite a battle with the guy selling me the ticket in
> order to persuade him that since my son was 15 when I bought the
> railcard he should still be allowed to travel on a child's ticket.
>
> Eventually I had to go and get a brochure for F&F Railcard and
> point out the small print at the very bottom of the conditions:

I have had to wave the brochure at a few ticket clerks who didn't
believe that buying a ticket for a 2 year old - in order to get the
adult discounts - was OK.

Ian

"Connaire" <conn1231@> wrote in message
news:959c3e4b-efd6-425d-a305-3cb60f528101@x41g2000hsb..com...
>
>> How did the ticket clerk know your son was 16? Do family railcards have
>> birth dates on them?
>>
>> I've never seen anyone asking for a child fare asked to prove their age
>> (might be different in other areas).
>>
>> peter

>Well mostly in the areas i've seen it its just a "When's your
>birthday? " Type question nobody lies on them obviously either that or
>ask for some form of i.d.
>Not that either get asked consistantly more hit and miss.

Family Railcards don't of course have birth dates on. This is because the
card is not specific to named children. Indeed the children don't have to be
family members - you just need to be able to strongarm any suitable person
(provided they were under 16 when the card was issued) to come along with
you as your passport to a cheap journey.

I'm surprised at the OP's experience, as the staff at Shrub Hill [1] are
usually quite switched on - and the "renew when your youngest child is 15
years and 364 days" idea is reasonably well known.

[1] I could well have believed it if it had been Foregate Street. I once had
a terrible experience there where the clerk refused to renew my daughter's
YP railcard but curiously would sell her a discounted ticket based on the
expired card. That would never have been believed on the train, of course.
However, it proved to be a false move as I allowed him to issue the ticket
and then threatened to call his supervisor and ask him to explain why he had
sold a discounted ticket despite knowing that she did not hold a valid
railcard. Railcard was then renewed *very* quickly.

Regards

Jonathan

In message <yMSdnZzp2I_qvujVnZ2dnUVZ8uCdnZ2d@pipex.net>, at 15:45:43 on
Wed, 9 Jul 2008, naked_draughtsman <usenet3@petereverett.co.uk>
remarked:
>I've never seen anyone asking for a child fare asked to prove their age
>(might be different in other areas).

Unaccompanied children aged 11-15 must have a photocard in London.
--
Roland Perry

In message <scGdnRQDdMCtd-jVnZ2dnUVZ8vmdnZ2d@bt.com>, at 11:30:35 on
Thu, 10 Jul 2008, Paul Scott <notvalidpmscott@> remarked:
>> Unaccompanied children aged 11-15 must have a photocard in London.
>
>Only for Oyster surely?

Not sure. When I last tried you couldn't buy a child ticket at a machine
so presumably the chap at the window is checking for eligibility.
--
Roland Perry

On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 19:20:05 +0100, "Paul Scott"
<notvalidpmscott@> wrote:

>
>"Charles Ellson" <charles@ellson.> wrote in message
>news:39ic74thhilhr0gfnul3blrvtfaao3pgnt@.. .
>> On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:30:35 +0100, "Paul Scott"
>> <notvalidpmscott@> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote in message
>>>news:NYFyDmRotddIFAyY@perry.co.uk...
>>>> In message <yMSdnZzp2I_qvujVnZ2dnUVZ8uCdnZ2d@pipex.net>, at 15:45:43 on
>>>> Wed, 9 Jul 2008, naked_draughtsman <usenet3@petereverett.co.uk>
>>>> remarked:
>>>>>I've never seen anyone asking for a child fare asked to prove their age
>>>>>(might be different in other areas).
>>>>
>>>> Unaccompanied children aged 11-15 must have a photocard in London.
>>>
>>>Only for Oyster surely?
>>>
>> Free travel on TfL bus and tram services in Greater London for
>> under-18s aged 11y or older requires use of an Oyster Card from 1 Jun
>> 2008. IIRC there are also the standard photocard requirement for child
>> season-ticket holders on NR services and existing requirements for
>> train travel on TfL services.
>>
>
>Season tickets on the railway are a slightly different issue - everyone
>needs a photocard unless using Oyster.
>
A photocard is still required with discounted Oyster cards.

>But does a child (under 16) require a
>photo card for an ordinary half fare rail ticket on part of the national
>network in London (which includes LO of course)?
>

On Jul 9, 9:45 pm, naked_draughtsman <usen...@petereverett.co.uk>
wrote:
> I've never seen anyone asking for a child fare asked to prove their age
> (might be different in other areas).

I take the viewpoint that if they're visibly drunk and/or pregnant
they're old enough to be paying full fare (16+).

Owain

On Jul 10, 10:50 am, Roland Perry <rol...@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <yMSdnZzp2I_qvujVnZ2dnUVZ8uCdn...@pipex.net>, at 15:45:43 on
> Wed, 9 Jul 2008, naked_draughtsman <usen...@petereverett.co.uk>
> remarked:
>
> >I've never seen anyone asking for a child fare asked to prove their age
> >(might be different in other areas).
>
> Unaccompanied children aged 11-15 must have a photocard in London.
>

And if you travel regularly in London, but don't live there, the
system for obtaining said items is so baroque (nay, rococo) that you
end up shrugging your shoulders and buying them an adult Oyster. I
can see why children from outside London shouldn't be entitled to the
fullest of full discounts, because those are funded by a precept on
London council tax payers. But it does seem invidious that it's hard
to get a standard Child discount on LUL that you could be able to get
for your children on National Rail. Children up to 12 can travel free
on LUL, but after that you either need a London photocard (it has some
fancy name: Go! or something) or pay the adult fare.

ian

On Jul 10, 6:54 pm, Charles Ellson <char...@ellson.> wrote:
> Anyone without a valid Oyster photocard will have to pay the adult
> cash single fare for their journey" :-

Fortunately, London isn't a tourist destination, and no part of
London's economy relies on people from outside London visiting with
families, so a nakedly hostile attempt to drive everyone under sixteen
who isn't a London resident to pay adult fares has no long-term
implications.

ian