Water temperature question

Here in the USA, due to occupational health and safety concerns,
almost all the cafe establishments operate with the restriction
of NO BOILING WATER!. As a consequence they are unable to brew
a decent pot of black tea!.
Now most of these places have espresso machines with milk steaming
attachments. So here's my question.
What is the temperature of the fluid (air/steam) which comes out
of the steaming heads? Is it above the boiling point of water?
and so, IF I ASKED NICELY, could be used by the barrista to heat
the water in the teapot to boiling, and so fit to brew a decent
pot of tea.
Asking them to nuke a pot doesn't work because:
- the pots usually have at least some metal fittings
- water in a mug often super heats, and explodes when
the cup is first disturbed.
--
Rostyk

> Never heard of such restriction. Is it just your local place? I can't
> imagine "no boiling water" ever being legislated for a food establishment.
> Bob

I don't know if it's legalized or not, but I currently work at such a
cafe (still in college, was a part time job this last semester, still
there for the summer months) and the espresso machine and drip coffee
maker we have don't bring the water to a boil. Boiling the water in a
pitcher using a steam nozzle is possible, but slightly difficult, as
the water tends to rapidly expand out the top of the pitcher in all
directions. So your barrista may not be open to such an idea, as it's
remarkably easy to burn oneself.

TeaDave wrote:
>> Never heard of such restriction. Is it just your local place? I can't
>> imagine "no boiling water" ever being legislated for a food establishment.
>> Bob
>
> I don't know if it's legalized or not, but I currently work at such a
> cafe (still in college, was a part time job this last semester, still
> there for the summer months) and the espresso machine and drip coffee
> maker we have don't bring the water to a boil. Boiling the water in a
> pitcher using a steam nozzle is possible, but slightly difficult, as
> the water tends to rapidly expand out the top of the pitcher in all
> directions. So your barrista may not be open to such an idea, as it's
> remarkably easy to burn oneself.
>
Thanks. I was hoping that it would be comparable, i.e. no more dangerous
than frothing milk. i.e. Fill the Bodum with the _hot_ water provided
for making tea, steam that to a boil, and then put in the brewing cup
with its tea and plunger.
Well it looks like I'll have to stick to green teas at the cafe
in the local Barnes and Noble or Borders book stores. :(

Even in restaurants getting tea brewed with boiling water is almost
impossible around here. :(, and they usually have only the dinky
one cup capacity pots and no choice in teas.
--
Rostyk

Am 26 Jun 2007, Rostyslaw J. Lewyckyj schrieb:


> Thanks. I was hoping that it would be comparable, i.e. no more
> dangerous than frothing milk. i.e. Fill the Bodum with the _hot_ water
> provided for making tea, steam that to a boil, and then put in the
> brewing cup with its tea and plunger. Well it looks like I'll have to
> stick to green teas at the cafe in the local Barnes and Noble or
> Borders book stores. :(

Considering the quality of the tea you would get, this is no great
loss. Of course, the green tea is never very good, either.

--
barutanseijin@

On Jun 25, 3:28 pm, "Rostyslaw J. Lewyckyj" <urj...@>
wrote:
> Here in the USA, due to occupational health and safety concerns,
> almost all the cafe establishments operate with the restriction
> of NO BOILING WATER!. As a consequence they are unable to brew
> a decent pot of black tea!.
> Now most of these places have espresso machines with milk steaming
> attachments. So here's my question.
> What is the temperature of the fluid (air/steam) which comes out
> of the steaming heads? Is it above the boiling point of water?
> and so, IF I ASKED NICELY, could be used by the barrista to heat
> the water in the teapot to boiling, and so fit to brew a decent
> pot of tea.
> Asking them to nuke a pot doesn't work because:
> - the pots usually have at least some metal fittings
> - water in a mug often super heats, and explodes when
> the cup is first disturbed.
> --
> Rostyk

I don't see why not. I routinely do this when I need a quick cup or
so of boiling water for tea, or any cooking need. Hot water from my
marzocco's hot water tap comes out at near boiling temp as well.

I also should note that I don't know squat about tea. I recently
learned from some tea folk that boiling water is not the right call
for brewing some teas. Maybe you know something about that?

-Greg

Barutan Seijin wrote:
> Am 26 Jun 2007, Rostyslaw J. Lewyckyj schrieb:
>
>
>> Thanks. I was hoping that it would be comparable, i.e. no more
>> dangerous than frothing milk. i.e. Fill the Bodum with the _hot_ water
>> provided for making tea, steam that to a boil, and then put in the
>> brewing cup with its tea and plunger. Well it looks like I'll have to
>> stick to green teas at the cafe in the local Barnes and Noble or
>> Borders book stores. :(
>
> Considering the quality of the tea you would get, this is no great
> loss. Of course, the green tea is never very good, either.
>
>
Agreed. But I go to the bookstores primarily to browse and read
the books, and not for the tea or coffee. Although the tea and
coffee there is better than in the standard (not specialty)
restaurants. At least one can order a pot of "green tips" or
"english breakfast" and not be served a bag of: Salada, Liptons,
or some restaurant suppliers tea. Also the coffee is generally
better, and so is the choice of pastries.
Which is all meant as faint praise.
--
Rostyk

On 27 Jun 2007 14:27:03 -0400, Lewis Perin <perin@panix.com> wrote:

> Jim <askme@beforeyousend.com> writes:
>
> > [...]
> > I'm reading this from coffee. When I drink tea, it's usually a
> > green tea, and I've been told it's best NOT to use boiling water, but
> > something at around 185 degrees or so (if my memory serves me).
>
> Actually, I like most greens brewed cooler than that, some as cool as
> 140F.

Can you describe how it tastes different when you use cooler water?

--
Ken Blake
Please Reply to the Newsgroup

On 27 Jun 2007 15:30:17 -0400, Lewis Perin <perin@panix.com> wrote:

> Ken Blake <kblake@this.is.an.invalid.domain> writes:
>
> > On 27 Jun 2007 14:27:03 -0400, Lewis Perin <perin@panix.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Jim <askme@beforeyousend.com> writes:
> > >
> > > > [...]
> > > > I'm reading this from coffee. When I drink tea, it's usually a
> > > > green tea, and I've been told it's best NOT to use boiling water, but
> > > > something at around 185 degrees or so (if my memory serves me).
> > >
> > > Actually, I like most greens brewed cooler than that, some as cool as
> > > 140F.
> >
> >
> > Can you describe how it tastes different when you use cooler water?
>
> Sweeter, less astringent, and if it's really good tea, there could be
> lots of nuances: fruity, floral, nutty.

Thank you. I'll have to try it that way.

--
Ken Blake
Please Reply to the Newsgroup

Am 27 Jun 2007, Lewis Perin schrieb:


> Not to mention the fact that the taste of a paper cup is stronger than
> that of almost any green tea...

That's true of the stale green tea in a bag you're likely to get in a
café in the US.

I'm guessing you've never had matcha. That'll knock your socks off.

--
barutanseijin@

Lewis Perin wrote:
> Jim <askme@beforeyousend.com> writes:
>
>
>>Lewis Perin wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Jim <askme@beforeyousend.com> writes:
>>>
>>>
>>>>[...]
>>>>I'm reading this from coffee. When I drink tea, it's usually a
>>>>green tea, and I've been told it's best NOT to use boiling water, but
>>>>something at around 185 degrees or so (if my memory serves me).
>>>
>>>Actually, I like most greens brewed cooler than that, some as cool as
>>>140F.
>>
>>I thought 185 might be on the high side, but I know I used hotter than
>>140. I'll have to try some both ways. I still have a couple of the
>>"flower ball" things I need to try out.
>
>
> Not to discourage you from using a cooler temperature, but those
> display teas probably need it less than most greens simply because
> display teas tend to be made from big, mature leaves. You'd get
> dramatic results from cool brewing with green teas manufactured from
> tiny, early spring buds and leaves.

Thanks. I really know very little about tea. I generally go to a place
in Seattle's International District, and buy loose green tea in a mid or
upper mid price range, and hope for the best. The display teas are a
novelty that I had to check out. If you have a suggestion for what to
look for when I buy green tea, I'd welcome it.