Pitch vs. trim in flight phases

gatt wrote:
> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>
>>> I don't know how that compares to the Saitek Aviator which is what I
>>> use, but I'm thinking of removing the springs and replacing them with
>>> stiffer ones to make it a bit more realistic.
>>>
>
>> Ah yes......but at what airspeed? (slugs dynamic pressure vs unboosted
>> control surfaces :-))
>
> Ooh. Good point. I wonder if a series of small electric motors could
> be used to spool up bungee tension corresponding to appropriate
> pressures. Not sure how the big sims do it.
>
>
>
>
> -c
>
Not sure myself. It would have to be a complicated program. Even the
control surface area is a factor, and each aircraft would be affected
differently.

--
Dudley Henriques

Gatt,

> The Airplane Flying Handbook, FAA-H-8083-3A, states:
>

Ah, another free source our local hotshot doesn't even bother to read.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

"Jay Maynard" wrote ...
> ... I consider inop electric trim (either elevator or
> aileron) to be a no go condition in the Zodiac.
>

Do Zodiacs come with aileron trim standard, or did you mean rudder trim?

On Jun 3, 8:32 am, "BDS" <skyh...@************> wrote:
> Well then, once you get to the point of having no pressure on the yoke,
> what's the point of trimming any further?

The point is not that you get to where there is no pressure on the
yoke. The point is that moving the trim without moving the yoke will
never get you there. You have to move the yoke as you move the trim
to get to where the pitch is correct without applying pressure.

Michael

On Jun 3, 4:55 pm, More_Flaps <Morefl...@**********> wrote:
> Here's my understanding : If the yoke gives force feedback of the out
> of trim condition (you hold attitude and then trim) then if you turn
> the trim the wrong while then holding attitude yoke pressure will
> increase -as Tina says.

In theory this is right - but in practice you will have to turn it a
long time before the increase is noticeable with certain trim systems.

> If it doesn't then you are not holding
> attitude OR the stick is not connected directly to the elevator
> surface (e.g. elevator is hydraulic or trim surface powered).

There is a third option - this is where the trim surface is not
connected to the elevator - which is indeed the case. The yoke forces
come from the elevator not being 'in trail' with the stabilizer in
such a system. Since the angle of the stabilizer changes very little
as trim is applied, the force on the yoke in a given position also
changes very little. If you move the yoke in the correct direction to
maintain the pitch attitude, the force on the yoke will change as it
should - but this is also the case in a primitive sim since the stick
has a spring return.

> I know
> the latter is the case for big planes (where elevator forces are too
> large for one armed man power) but what light piston single are you
> thinking about?

I'm thinking of the short wing Pipers - the most popular of which was
the TriPacer.

Michael