Confusion

"Patrick" <pwhalen1@> wrote in message
news:0786ab4a-9ca9-4b62-9174-e3d8af2c41e4@e10g2000prf..com...
> Jon,
>
> The turn should have started at 400 agl, right?

I normally turn at 400 to 500 AGL, but in this case a turn at that altitude
would have put me into the path of a 172 that had departed from the parallel
runway. Tower had called the traffic, although he said the traffic was going
to make a right crosswind turn, when he meant left.

And BTW, I was told to turn left heading 300, not 3000. (That's the hard way
to get to 120. <g>)

On Nov 27, 10:14 am, "Jon Woellhaf" <jonwoell...@> wrote:

> I said I'd proceed on course VFR and asked if they'd get me a clearance.
> They soon got it and handed me off to departure.
>
> Guess I'll remember to remind Tower that I'm IFR from now on, although I
> didn't think that was necessary. At least in this case, it was.

This has happened to me several times. Now I *NEVER* tell the tower
I'm ready for take off if I'm IFR, I say "Ready for Release". Since
then I've never had a problem.

BTW: Once this could have been really dangerous. I was flying out of
Santa Barbara where they often use a different runway for IFR and VFR.
I told the tower I was ready to take off on runway XXX. Tower
responded with "Cleared for take off". I said "that airliner on final
looks really close". Tower said "Oh, I thought you were VFR I didn't
realize you were at runway XXX". So bottom line, never say "take off"
when you're IFR.

-Robert

"Robert M. Gary" <N7093v@> wrote in message
news:b4237544-f0b6-4744-870e-489d7d742b75@i12g2000prf..com...
> This has happened to me several times. Now I *NEVER* tell the tower
> I'm ready for take off if I'm IFR, I say "Ready for Release". Since
> then I've never had a problem.
>
> BTW: Once this could have been really dangerous. I was flying out of
> Santa Barbara where they often use a different runway for IFR and VFR.
> I told the tower I was ready to take off on runway XXX. Tower
> responded with "Cleared for take off". I said "that airliner on final
> looks really close". Tower said "Oh, I thought you were VFR I didn't
> realize you were at runway XXX". So bottom line, never say "take off"
> when you're IFR.

Yikes! I'm in the habit of telling tower when I'm VFR and usually do say
when I'm IFR. This was just the wrong time omit it. I like your suggestion
and will now say, "IFR to [destination], ready for release." I also say what
runway I'm at.

....and don't hold short, hold shorter than short :), i.e. where other planes
can get around you if you need to wait a few minutes for release. At the
wrong time here at RHV, you might have to wait 15-20 minutes (or more).

Hilton

"Jon Woellhaf" <jonwoellhaf@> wrote in message
news:5-qdnRYoiJwzENHanZ2dnUVZ_jqdnZ2d@...
> "Robert M. Gary" <N7093v@> wrote in message
> news:b4237544-f0b6-4744-870e-489d7d742b75@i12g2000prf..com...
>> This has happened to me several times. Now I *NEVER* tell the tower
>> I'm ready for take off if I'm IFR, I say "Ready for Release". Since
>> then I've never had a problem.
>>
>> BTW: Once this could have been really dangerous. I was flying out of
>> Santa Barbara where they often use a different runway for IFR and VFR.
>> I told the tower I was ready to take off on runway XXX. Tower
>> responded with "Cleared for take off". I said "that airliner on final
>> looks really close". Tower said "Oh, I thought you were VFR I didn't
>> realize you were at runway XXX". So bottom line, never say "take off"
>> when you're IFR.
>
> Yikes! I'm in the habit of telling tower when I'm VFR and usually do say
> when I'm IFR. This was just the wrong time omit it. I like your suggestion
> and will now say, "IFR to [destination], ready for release." I also say
> what runway I'm at.
>

"Jon Woellhaf" <jonwoellhaf@> wrote in message
news:DM-dnYELbrWeFtHanZ2dnUVZ_jmdnZ2d@...
>
> Looks like the cover up didn't work too well, because when I told
> Departure, "I thought I was IFR," he replied, "Well, that's what we
> thought too, but evidently Tower messed up."
>

What was the departure airport?

Hilton wrote:
> ...and don't hold short, hold shorter than short :), i.e. where other planes
> can get around you if you need to wait a few minutes for release. At the
> wrong time here at RHV, you might have to wait 15-20 minutes (or more).
>
At some fields what that will get you is the inability to take off when
you are released.

"Newps" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:ZL2dnWYC0fmSDNDanZ2dnUVZ_uyinZ2d@bresnan.com. ..
>
> It is precisely for this reason that when I worked at GFK, home of UND and
> the 75 airplane departure rush every couple of hours, that we would not
> read you your IFR clearance until you were ready to go.
>

Great idea. Put the lengthier transmissions on the local control frequency
when 75 airplanes are looking to depart. I'm sure they don't mind waiting
for that IFR departure while he reviews his clearance at the hold short
line.

On 11/28/07 08:04, Newps wrote:
>
> Jon Woellhaf wrote:
>
>> "Robert M. Gary" <N7093v@> wrote in message
>> news:b4237544-f0b6-4744-870e-489d7d742b75@i12g2000prf..com...
>>
>>>This has happened to me several times. Now I *NEVER* tell the tower
>>>I'm ready for take off if I'm IFR, I say "Ready for Release". Since
>>>then I've never had a problem.
>>>
>>>BTW: Once this could have been really dangerous. I was flying out of
>>>Santa Barbara where they often use a different runway for IFR and VFR.
>>>I told the tower I was ready to take off on runway XXX. Tower
>>>responded with "Cleared for take off". I said "that airliner on final
>>>looks really close". Tower said "Oh, I thought you were VFR I didn't
>>>realize you were at runway XXX". So bottom line, never say "take off"
>>>when you're IFR.
>>
>>
>> Yikes! I'm in the habit of telling tower when I'm VFR and usually do say
>> when I'm IFR. This was just the wrong time omit it. I like your suggestion
>> and will now say, "IFR to [destination], ready for release." I also say what
>> runway I'm at.
>
>
>
> It is precisely for this reason that when I worked at GFK, home of UND
> and the 75 airplane departure rush every couple of hours, that we would
> not read you your IFR clearance until you were ready to go.

So you expect an aircraft to take off right after you read them their
clearance?

The pilot is going to need some time to digest the clearance. I certainly
wouldn't just take the clearance without regard and depart.

Normally, I would request my clearance after I've completed my run-up,
but I would still need a couple minutes to check the charts and make
sure the clearance is acceptable (unless it was 'as filed', of course).


> Very
> occasionally someone would really want their clearance right away but
> then we made you sit on the ramp and tell us when you were done with
> your runup, etc.



--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane, USUA Ultralight Pilot
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

Steven P. McNicoll asked
> What was the departure airport?

KFFZ. Falcon Field, Mesa, Arizona.

"Newps" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:mrCdnYhMDqXHAdDanZ2dnUVZ_tyknZ2d@bresnan.com. ..
>
> The aircraft called ground control when he was done with his runup and
> said he was ready for the clearance. GC read him the clearance and then
> gave the strip to the data man for the release.
>

Hmmm..., previously you said the clearance wouldn't be issued until the
aircraft was ready to go.


>
> Every clearance was as filed. Always. There's nothing to digest if you
> flight planned properly.
>

Nobody ever filed an unacceptable route? That seems VERY unlikely.